Guy Nattiv does not really have time to speak with me. Four years after the globally successful Israeli director won an Oscar for the English short film "Skin" (and released his first Hollywood feature film, also called "Skin"), he is once again about to enter the eye of the storm.
Follow Israel Hayom on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram
In a few days, Nattiv will leave his home in Los Angeles, the city in which he and his family have been living for the past decade, and go on a busy and intensive PR tour of the United States' East Coast to promote his new and highly anticipated international movie - "Golda", a biographic war drama starring the legendary actor, Helen Mirren, following Israeli Prime Minister Golda Meir during the dreadful days of the Yom Kippur War.
But before he leaves, he needs to finish the sound work on his next and very intriguing film, "Tatami," which he co-created with two Iranian partners and is about to have its world premiere at the upcoming Venice International Film Festival.
"It's quite a crazy time," he tells me over the phone as he makes his way to the soundstage at Sony Studios, where his sound technicians are waiting for him so that they can do some final touchups on "Tatami." "Not only is 'Golda' coming out now in Israel and Europe, but next week it's also being released in 1200 theatres all over the United States – which is completely insane when you consider the fact that we are living in an era where almost all the movies that are not big box office hits go straight to streaming.
Video: The trailer to Golda
"But due to the actors' and writers' strike that has been paralyzing Hollywood for the past few months – all the PR is on me. Understand: there is no Helen or anybody else. So, I am going to eight different states alone. It's my first time doing something like this, but I do not have a choice. I must do everything possible."
As for the timing of "Golda's" release in Israel, Nattiv actually believes the film "could not have come out at a better time," and not just because this coming Yom Kippur marks 50 years since the war.
"There is no doubt that there is a resemblance between 1973 and today," he says. "It is more than a resemblance. Fifty years after the failure of 1973, we are once again seeing a disturbing spectacle of a detached government ignoring the warnings it is being given. The commander of the Israeli Air Force says, 'We are in danger.' And Bibi and his partners completely ignore this whole thing and continue to charge like a bunch of crazies toward a revolution that will bring disaster upon us. This is far greater than the Yom Kippur failure. The one who will be held accountable for this at the end of the day is the Prime Minister. Who knows what will happen in a few months? It's frightening to think about."
"I wanted to film in black and white"
"Golda," which had its world premiere at the Berlin International Film Festival (and opened the Jerusalem Film Festival last month), is one of the only narrative films to date that depict the trauma of the Yom Kippur War.
The script, written by British producer and writer Nicolas Martin ("Florence Foster Jenkins"), takes viewers back to the events of October 1973, focusing on Golda during those fateful days when it seemed that the IDF was facing a crushing defeat at the hands of the Egyptian and Syrian armies.
"Due to the actors' and writers' strike that has been paralyzing Hollywood for the past few months – all the PR is on me. Understand: there is no Helen or anybody else. So, I am going to eight different states alone. It's my first time doing something like this, but I do not have a choice. I must do everything possible."
The film also paints an intimate and deeply human portrait of the first and only woman (so far) to serve as Prime Minister in Israel. It presents parts of her testimony at the Agranat Commission that was established to investigate the war's failures, shows her receiving secret radiation treatments to combat the leukemia she was suffering from at the time, and lingers on her unique relationship with U.S. Secretary of State Henry Kissinger.
This film is impressive in every aspect. Helen Mirren delivers an outstanding performance and fully embodies Golda's character. The directing is accurate and devoid of unnecessary embellishments, and the sound work stands out for its effectiveness. With the constant presence of clouds of cigarette smoke (back then, apparently, everyone was a chain smoker, especially Golda), Nattiv succeeds in creating a suffocating, oppressive, claustrophobic, and nerve-wracking atmosphere.
The Israeli supporting actors surrounding Mirren – including Rami Heuberger in a chilling appearance as Defense Minister Moshe Dayan, Lior Ashkenazi as IDF Chief of Staff David ("Dado") Elazar, Dvir Benedek as head of the Military Intelligence Directorate Eli Zeira, and Rotem Keinan as Mossad director Tzvi Zamir – all do a fantastic job.
Secretary of State Kissinger is portrayed by the Jewish-American supporting actor Liev Schreiber ("Ray Donovan"), and the high-quality cast is complemented by French actress Camille Cottin (from the popular series "Call My Agent!") playing Golda's personal assistant and confidante, Lou Keidar.
"Golda" began its journey on the Amazon streaming platform long before the COVID pandemic. Interestingly, the one who was in the advanced stages of negotiations to direct it before it was decided to entrust the reins to Nattiv was none other than Barbara Streisand.
"Barbara was friendly with Golda, and there is a YouTube video of her interviewing her affectionately," explains Nattiv. "Originally, it was a very different film. When I first joined the project, it already had a script, and there were other directors I had to compete with for the role. But it was also supposed to be an enormous war epic—an incredible three-hour saga. There were battle scenes with exploding tanks in the style of "Saving Private Ryan," and the budget was something like USD 70 million. In fact, even then, they spoke with Helen Mirren because Golda's grandson, Gidi Meir, said that she reminded him of his grandmother. But Golda was a much smaller part of the story."
"In the original version, the characters in 'Golda' spoke in a kind of 'British' manner, like in 'The Crown.' It was not believable and not authentic. I told the producers that I needed to get into the depths of the script and change it, put the war inside smoke-filled rooms and hallways. They loved the idea."
After the outbreak of the COVID-19 pandemic, the project left the Amazon platform, moved to the hands of independent producers, and experienced a noticeable budget cut. Meanwhile, to Nattiv's delight, the discussions with Streisand did not materialize, and another competitor for the role, director James Gray, decided to pivot and make a science fiction film with Brad Pitt instead.
But surprisingly, before Nattiv chose to accept the role, he chose to present some rather strict conditions for the producers.
"I said to them: 'Listen, I cannot do this movie without delving into the depths of the script and changing it.' Initially, it was a very inflated script, and all the characters spoke in a kind of 'British' manner, like in 'The Crown.' It wasn't believable, and it wasn't authentic. I wanted to incorporate dialogues from the official protocols of the war, and I wanted to focus on Golda."
"The idea was to make a character piece, to really get under her skin. I told the producers: 'Let's bring the war into smoke-filled rooms, bunkers and hallways. Let's get rid of all the battle scenes and just use the real sound of what happened there.' And they liked this idea.
"Besides that, I had three more conditions: Israeli actors would portray Golda's military entourage, the film would be in Hebrew, and it would be in black and white."
Q: Are you serious? Where did you get the courage to make these demands? Were you not worried they would tell you, "Okay, bye," and simply move on to the next person on the list of candidates?
"On some level, maybe I wanted them to tell me 'No' so that I could tell myself, 'This is not my movie, this is not my journey.' Because under no circumstances was I willing to make a propaganda film like 'Exodus.' I did not want the film to have 'romantic fluff.' I wanted to do a more personal and less national film. I wanted to present Golda to the audience from a different place, a place we do not know. So, I piled up difficulties for the producers to see how open they would be to my ideas.
"They did not agree to do the movie in black and white, and in the end, we decided not to do it in Hebrew either. But they did agree to other things. We cast Israeli actors, for example, and in the deal I made with them, they did give me the right to veto, which is super rare. The second I had this right to veto, I felt much more protected and secure. I felt like they really wanted my authentic Israeli voice. I was very happy that they had to courage to go to a darker and less flattering place and do a film that does not try to suck up to the audience."
Makeup and sacks on her legs
Despite the widespread agreements Nattiv reached with the producers, he had one more hurdle to jump through before he officially got the job: he needed the approval of the lead actress, Mirren – something that didn't turn out to be a significant problem.
"Helen simply came to my home in the middle of the pandemic, wearing flip flops and with her hair up," Nattiv recounts his first meeting with the iconic actress. "We sat and talked for three hours and had an incredible connection. She's one of the cinema legends, no doubt. On the level of Meryl Streep, in my opinion. A woman without an ego. She speaks to you at eye level, without pretenses or a chauffeur or anything like that. Yet, you can sense how strong she is. There is something very British and regal about her. I was very impressed with her readiness and openness. She said to me: 'Listen, I'm not an Israeli. So, I'm counting on you to lead me.'"
Q: How much did the script change after you joined as the director?
"As I mentioned, it was an entirely different film before I joined. If you read the previous script, you will be shocked. There is no similarity whatsoever. Nicolas Martin's original idea was to make a war movie par excellence. But that did not interest me much. For example, Golda's battle with cancer was not in the original script. The walk through the hospital's morgue was not in the original script. Even the scenes from the Agranat Commission were not in the original script."
"Helen came to my home in the middle of the pandemic, wearing flip-flops and her hair up. We sat and talked for hours, and we had an incredible connection. She is a woman without an ego. She speaks to you at eye level, without pretenses or a chauffeur. Yet, you can sense how strong she is. There is something regal about her."
Q: What was Mirren's familiarity with Golda and the story of the war?
"Helen was very eager to portray this character. She has a warm relationship with Israel and Israelis and amazing memories of Israel. She toured Israel from north to south with her Jewish British boyfriend after the Six-Day War. She volunteered in a kibbutz and worked in fruit picking. Even during our most difficult times, she always stood with us.
"She read books on Golda and did research, and after reading the new script, she told me that although she does not understand everything, she is very glad we are abandoning the war scenes and are instead focusing on Golda and her pain. Slowly, while working, she was exposed to more layers of the character's personality. She told me from the beginning: 'Do you realize we are entering a minefield, a highly controversial place?' I told her that I do, and she said: 'If you are ready, then so am I.'"
Q: Her performance in the film is so incredible that while watching it, there were several times I almost forgot it was her. What was it like to see her in full makeup as Golda for the first time?
"It was absolutely bizarre. It took us two weeks to get the right look in terms of makeup and prosthetics because Helen wanted it to be clear that it was her, that it was 'her Golda,' and it took time to achieve that exact balance. But from the moment we started filming, I no longer saw Helen. I only saw Golda. Every day, she was in the makeup trailer for three and a half hours – from 4:00 to 7:30 in the morning – and left it as Golda. She ate lunch with us as Golda. She went to the restroom as Golda. She took a nap as Golda.
"She walked around with these sorts of sacks on her legs because Golda had swollen legs. She wore a fat suit on her body. She enveloped herself in Golda and never took her off. Understand we are talking about a 78-year-old woman. We all get up at 7:00 in the morning, and she wakes up every day at 4:00! You would not hear a peep of complaint out of her. Nothing."
Q: What did you learn from working with her?
"A lot. First and foremost, seeing her work is incredible. Lior Ashkenazi came to me and said that what she does is like a school for acting. Her nuances, the way she moves, how she gets into character, the way she speaks – everything is so precise. Just wow.
"She taught me behavioral codes, and I was exposed to a level of professionalism I have never known. She has a saying she tells everyone: 'Don't be an ass, and be on time.' That is her motto. Very simple. Another thing I learned from her is power naps. She has a habit of taking an hour-long power nap at noon to reset herself. This is something I adopted. It is so right to shut everything down in the middle of the day. Without shame, without feeling like you are doing something wrong. And boom – you wake up like new and function much better."
"There is no doubt that there is a resemblance between 1973 and today. Fifty years after the failure of the Yom Kippur War, we are once again witnessing a disturbing display of a detached government ignoring the warnings it is being given. On the other hand, in 1973 – Golda resigned. Can you imagine a Prime Minister today resigning due to a failure?"
But not everyone supported the casting of Mirren, a non-Jewish actress, for the role of Golda. Some even accused the film's production of "Jewface" – a derogatory term coined by Jewish-American comedian Sarah Silverman, referring to cases where a non-Jewish actor portrays a Jewish character.
In an interview that made headlines online last year, British-Jewish comedian and theatre actress Maureen Lipman said that Mirren's casting was inappropriate because Golda's Jewishness is an inseparable part of her identity. "Ben Kingsley will never be allowed to play Nelson Mandela," she added.
"All the headlines following Lipman's comments were published while we were in the midst of filming," Nattiv recalls. "There is no doubt that they were very surprising and disappointing. Personally, I do not think Lipman's arguments have any teeth to them, but I do believe that this discussion on casting, in general, is good. Today, for example, Tom Hanks would probably not be cast as Forrest Gump. They would try to cast an actor with disabilities.
"However, this pendulum is taking things to the extreme, to the point that it is beginning to harm the art of acting. Because what will really happen if only a Jewish actor can portray a Jewish character? Does it mean that tomorrow, a Jewish character will not be able to portray a non-Jewish character? This debate creates a very dangerous situation. On the one hand, it cannot be ignored or silenced. But on the other hand, when I first met Helen, I saw Golda before my eyes.
"Helen also said: 'Listen, if I do not do a good job, I will be able to understand the criticism.' But she is doing an excellent job. She is the most Golda one can be. So, apparently, you cannot please everyone."
"It was very surprising and disappointing to hear the criticism against Helen Mirren's portrayal of a Jewish character. This debate is taking things to a very extreme and dangerous place. Because if only a Jew can portray a Jewish character, does that mean that tomorrow a Jew will not be able to play a non-Jewish character?"
Subscribe to Israel Hayom's daily newsletter and never miss our top stories!
