United Torah Judaism leader, outgoing Health Minister Yakov Litzman, still carries a pager. He's probably one of only a handful of people to still carry around the antiquated device, which has become somewhat obsolete in a digital age dominated by emails and text messages. Smartphones are forbidden in ultra-Orthodox society and particularly in the Gerrer Hasidic sect.
Litzman has been the subject of scathing public censure since the coronavirus pandemic hit Israel over his ministry's handling of the outbreak. Several weeks ago, he tested positive for the virus, sending dozens of top officials, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, into self-isolation, further fueling criticism that he himself has been violating the social distancing directive imposed on the public. He has since made a full recovery.
Q: Maybe that was part of the public's problem with you – when you went into home-quarantine you had to have internet especially installed. The health minister, in the middle of a pandemic, without internet? It's 2020 after all.
"That's true, when I went into isolation, I had it installed to hold video calls etc. It took me a while to get used to it. Now that I've recovered, I'm not sure I'll keep using it. Personally, I'm not tech-savvy. I have a kosher, 'stupid' phone – not a smartphone. I have no TV at home and no internet connection.
"I don't think that's a problem. On the contrary – I'm not distracted by the smartphone so I have more time to handle urgent things. I don't miss anything, I have staffers who keep me posted over everything and that's all I need."
"I'm proud of the fact that I'm technologically disconnected," he stressed. "I'm still aware of technological innovations, especially in the medical field and we're doing everything we can to make sure the healthcare system continues to lead – in cyber, in digital [services], and in innovative computing. So it's not an issue."
'I didn't want to rattle the system'
United Torah Judaism had controlled the Health portfolio since 2009, with a brief pause between 2013 and 2015, when it was held by the Yesh Atid party. But last week, in the midst of the war against the coronavirus, Litzman asked Netanyahu to be appointed construction and housing minister in the next government.
"My interest in the Construction and Housing [portfolio] goes back a long time, as was my desire to leave [the Health Ministry]. Before the elections there was pressure in the [Haredi] public that we should focus on the housing issue," Litzman said.
Real estate prices in Israel have soared over the past decade, reaching levels that have prompted the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, which Israel joined in 2010, to warned that the Israeli housing market could see a ""severe correction"" in the coming years, which could adversely affect the economy as a whole.
In 2016, Finance Minister Moshe Kahlon introduced lottery-based Buyer's Price affordable housing program, but it has failed to deliver on its promise of rapid construction at prices the middle- and lower classes can afford.
The housing crisis has hit the ultra-Orthodox community – whose socio-economic statue is, for the most part, low due to its limited integration in the workforce – particularly hard.
According to a 2018 study by the Construction and Housing Ministry, the Haredi public will require some 200,000 additional housing units by 2035. How and where these residences should be built is a complex question in and of itself, as currently, the ultra-Orthodox predominantly live in the central Israeli city of Bnei Brak and Jerusalem.
"I didn't want to leave in the middle of the war on the coronavirus. I didn't want to rattle the system, to make people think I was running away in the middle of the big crisis in Israel and the world. But now, when things are starting to settle down – stores are opening again, school will start soon, and with a new government forming and new positions becoming available – now is the time to move on."
Q: Or maybe you decided to leave because of the growing criticism leveled at you.
"I can't comment on all the lies in the media. Like the story about IKEA being allowed to reopen stores, which some claimed I approved because the owner is a Gerrer Hasid so he's a Gerrer donor. It's nonsense. I've had no dealing with him and he's not a Gerrer Hasid. Besides, how would I know if he's a Gerrer Hasid? It had nothing to do with me."
Q: So why were they allowed to open stores so early in the lockdown exit process?
"The Finance Ministry pressured the Health Ministry – but not me personally. I knew nothing about it and no one asked me. No one even talked to me about it."
Q: How is it possible that the health minister knows nothing about it?
"The media has to decide, once and for all, if they want me to listen to the professional advisers [in the ministry]. When I don't – they [the media] criticize me. If I do – they also criticize me. Enough! I knew nothing about the IKEA opening yet some newspapers made it their headline. Why? To mud-sling. If I weren't Haredi no one would care."
Q: So the criticism is because you're Haredi?
"Without a doubt. The moment I became popular – I was named one of the most popular ministers in the government – they began coming after me."
Q: A health minister who steps down in the middle of a pandemic is like the chief of staff walking out in the middle of a war.
"We're not in the middle [of the pandemic]. We can see the end of it. I waited as long as I could to announce I want to move to the Housing and Construction Ministry."
Q: Some would say you're trying to escape a commission of inquiry.
"That's not the case. I assume there will be a commission of inquiry and they will be able to talk to me wherever I am. It has nothing to do with which ministry I'm in."
Q: And what will you tell them?
"That I'm the first one who realized that there was a problem. I decided to stop planes from landing here back in February. I closed the sky at a time when the Foreign Affairs Ministry mocked me, when all the ambassadors pressured against it. Today, everyone says that, among other things, that [decision] was what saved us and kept morbidity low."
Q: so you leaving the Health Ministry is giving into pressure and negative press?
"No. The negative press will continue regardless."
Q: Blue and White demanded the Health portfolio during the unity talks and you said there was no way United Torah Judaism was giving it up.
"Had I agreed it would have looked like they [Blue and White] were able to remove me [from office] and that wasn't the case. Now there's a general agreement that the worst of the coronavirus is behind us, so now is the right time."
Q: Can we safely say that in about two months, this will all be behind us?
"That depends on how much we observe the rules," he said. "We don't know – no one knows – if or when another [outbreak] will come. We have to follow the directives as we have been doing so far. Right now, we can ease the restriction so that's what we're doing. Everything is under constant review."
Q: Is going back to the pre-corona era even possible?
"It's hard to say but nothing is impossible. Hopefully we'll find a vaccine. The entire world is working on that. But we still have to be very careful."
'Public health comes first'
Q: How would you rate the Health Ministry's handling of the crisis? Could it be that you were too strict?
"We were. It was the chosen policy, to be strict. There were times when I thought some restrictions were unnecessary and went too far. For example, I didn't think we would have 10,000 fatalities. I said as much behind closed doors."
Q: And yet, despite your opinion, the ministry imposed the strictest restrictions it could.
"I don't regret that," Liztman asserted. "It was the right thing to do. It kept us safe. It's why we're one of the countries spared the worst" of the global pandemic.
Those strict measures, however, took their toll on the economy.
The government halted nearly all economic activity starting in early March. The shuttering of businesses ordered as part of the efforts to curb the spread of the virus has slowed economic activity to only 15%, forcing many private-sector businesses to either fire employees or place them on unpaid leave.
Since the measures were announced, unemployment has soared to an unprecedented 26% – compared to 4% prior to the outbreak – with over a million Israelis filing for unemployment benefits.
Q: The damage inflicted by the Health Ministry's prevention measure is staggering.
"You're talking about money – I don't care about money. I care about public health, human life."
Q: It affected lives, as well. There were people who didn't seek medical attention because they were afraid of getting infected in the hospital, and ended up dying of heart attacks, for example.
"Those are all conspiracy theories. People talking for the sake of talking. Corona wards were separate from the emergency room and people who needed the ER came to the ER. People are just looking for excuses to criticize."
Q: What about all the people who lost their livelihood?
"Naturally, that's very serious and you can't discount that. Unemployment is terrible and it has to be dealt with, but to say that has to be the deciding factor when dealing with the coronavirus – it has nothing to do with it."
Q: There is an overall feeling that the decision-making process in the Health Ministry was – is – chaotic. The Health, Finance, Education, and Defense ministries – each was pulling in a different direction.
"Government ministries debate issues all the time. Each person has their own opinion and priorities and they present them to the government. That's how things are handled and that's fine."
Q: What about the argument that the Health Ministry's instructions were zigzagging?
"We didn't zigzag. We were going down one road – tighter restrictions, and that's what the situation called for," he stated.
Q: Maybe people in the Health Ministry acted out of fear of a future commission of inquiry? How else can one explain the discrepancy between the projected morbidity and mortality figures and reality?
"Nobody makes life-and-death decisions based on the scenarios of what a commission of inquiry may ask them after it's all over. The only consideration here is public health."
Q: There are those who argued that as health minister, you failed to lead the war against the coronavirus.
"It's the same kind of argument about listening to the professional echelon [at the Health Ministry]. When I took the lead, the complaint was, 'You're not a doctor, listen to the professionals.' When I did that, it's 'You're not taking charge of the situation.' There's no winning here."
Q: Defense Minister Naftali Bennett said his ministry should take over the fight against the pandemic, that they have the resources and experience in dealing with such wide-scope events.
"Absolutely not, this belongs in the Health Ministry," Litzman bristled. "This is not about resources or money. If it is – give the Health Ministry the money."
Q: What about the criticism that in the press conferences with Netanyahu and Health Ministry Director Moshe Bar Siman-Tov the reporters could barely hear you, that you were stuttering and quoting the Torah instead of talking about the virus?
"There are anti-Semites who saw me with a shtreimel and that's what bothered them," he said, referring to the fur hat worn by many Haredi men.
Q: So this is about how the average Tel Avivian can't take orders from the Haredi from Jerusalem?
"Of course it is. I saw the reports in the media. They didn't reflect what I said. They didn't care that I was the first [health minister in the world] to bar incoming flights – all they cared about was that I wore a shtreimel and why. You wear it on Shabbat and Saturday evening," he noted, referring to the fact that the press conference in question took place on Saturday night.
Some reporters, he continued, "Have no qualms about getting up in the morning and printing lies."
United Torah Judaism's leader firmly believes that the media lashing he has been receiving boils down to one thing: the fact that he is an ultra-Orthodox minister.
"Some reporters are anti-Semites. They can't stand to see a Haredi minister succeed," he charged.
Q: There's no public criticism?
"I meet ordinary Israelis. Everywhere I go, people respect me and wish me well. It's only the media that does the opposite."
Q: There was a lot of criticism over the fact that you, the prime minister and Bar Siman-Tov – the people managing the health crisis – are not physicians.
"Yet we still managed the crisis very well and the data proves it. Morbidity and mortality ratios are relatively low. Other countries look to us to learn how to deal with the virus. Doctors and healthcare professionals are involved in everything."
Q: Why didn't you form a "corona cabinet"?
"The entire government – every meeting is a corona cabinet. Every minister deals with it and presents it from their [ministry's] purview. Everyone is heard, there are diverse opinions on the matter. The results speak for themselves."
Q: In hindsight, did you make mistakes?
"Everyone makes mistakes. Perhaps I should have dealt with Bnei Brak differently, maybe we shouldn't have placed the entire city under quarantine."
The virus-stricken Haredi city in central Israel experienced a particularly bad outbreak over the residents' flouting of social distancing directives in the first two weeks of the nationwide lockdown.
With the contagion threatening the rest of the greater Tel Aviv area, the government ordered the police and the military to enforce the lockdown, cutting off access between Bnei Brak and the rest of the country, while stepping up efforts to aid residents and remove those carrying the potentially deadly pathogen to special hotels concerted to care for corona patients.
The move was later applied to several ultra-Orthodox neighborhoods in Jerusalem as a means of preventing the virus from running rampant through the capital.
Q: But didn't the quarantine save Bnei Brak?
"Yes, but we could have done that by isolating a neighborhood. We didn't have to cordon off the entire city. The anti-Semitism that ensued was horrific. The entire ultra-Orthodox community was vilified like never before. Had we quarantined just one neighborhood, as we did in Jerusalem, we wouldn't have seen such anti-Semitism against the Haredim."
Litzman, 71, maintains he still doesn't know exactly how he became infected with the coronavirus.
"I assume it was at the office or in one of the meetings we held with various officials, but the reports that I violated directives for prayer services are false. I can't really comment any further because there's an ongoing lawsuit on the matter," he said.
The outgoing health minister files a lawsuit against Channel 12 News over a report to that effect.
"All I can say is that the quorum took place before these things were banned. There were strict rules about praying out in the open, with maintaining distance and having no more than 10 people. That's exactly what happened."
The criticism, he insists, stems first and foremost from hatred toward the ultra-Orthodox sector.
"There should be a law against anti-Semitism expressions and discrimination against the Haredim," he said. "The criticism against me against stems from that. People can't stomach a Haredi in such a [senior government] position, it doesn't go down well."
Q: How would you summarize your term in the Health Ministry?
"Thankfully, I was able to accomplish plenty: I reformed dental care for children and the elderly; built another hospital and promotes the plans for two more; I've increased the number of MRIs machines in Israel from nine to 61; I increased the budget for the budget of the drug subsidies; led the food and nutritional labeling reform; I reformed psychiatric care; reduced the number of smokers; dealt with the issue of hospital infections, set up 20 emergency medical centers, and more.
"Truth be told, before my term no one wanted to have anything to do with the Health Ministry. I took it because it let me help people. It's perfectly natural to me that today the Health Ministry is so popular that it's key in the coalition talks."
Q: Any thoughts about what you want to do in the Housing and Construction Ministry?
"Not yet. We have to help young couples, the periphery. But I'll know more when I start working."
Q: Are you pleased with the potential makeup of the new government?
"We can already mark two achievements: a government without [Yesh Atid leader Yair] Lapid and without [Yisrael Beytenu head Avigdor] Liberman," Litzman says of the leaders of the two secular parties with the most hawkish agendas with respect to the demands they seek to impose on the ultra-Orthodox public in terms of the social equality in general, and in equal sharing of the civic burden in particular.
"We won seven [Knesset] seats. In the next government, we will fight for the fundamental things we care about – the conscription law and keeping Shabbat."
The issue of mandatory military service for the ultra-Orthodox sector has dogged Israeli politics for years, repeatedly sparking coalition crises. Many in the ultra-Orthodox community believe military service should be secondary to Torah study. However, secular Israelis oppose being expected to shoulder the burden without any contribution by a substantial sector of the population.
United Torah Judaism and Sephardi counterpart Shas have also been able to torpedo any attempt by secular parties to amend legislation to allow commerce on Saturdays – a bill mainly seeking to facilitate the operation of convenience stores – arguing it would change the religious-secular status quo.
Q: This is the best coalition you could hope for, isn't it?
"We can live with it."
